Charging up or down stairs

I want 3 dimensionality in warmachine when i can get it, and since the rules accomdate ladders, stairs and falling damage, it feels almost ecouraged.
Last week we were playing on a terrain piece that is basically a plateau with stairs on it. There was a model on top (A) and a model(B) wanted to charge it
We ruled this like a push or placement that occurs during a charge movement, ie B can charge up the stairs but moves no futher after being repostioned to the top. If B is in melee range then the charge is successful.

The problem is that the rules for stairs dont say “place the model” they say “repostion it”.

How would you play it?


Pics would help. Like it says in the book, discuss it with your opponent before the match.

I have some plateaus, and we’ve played them as scalable. They don’t have ladders, and they aren’t hills. When stacked, they have ledges of 1, 2, or 3 inches and taller.

We’ve played different ways. This is my favorite.
1 inch Steps could be charged up with pathfinder or flight.
2 inch and higher needed flight.

1 inch doesnt sacrifice any movemebt to climb. There is no “repositioning” the model at the top for 1 inch steps.
2 inch and higher could be climbed like a ladder, complete with “repositioning” the model.

Charging, slamming, and trampling require the model to move in a straight line.

Repositioning up stairs is not moving in a straight line.

Therefore, you cannot charge, slam, or trample up stairs.

And this one has stairs, but they’re blocked at an angle, and pretty shallow. So we’ve played it as, you can charge up the middle, but it has to be directly onward, because you have to move in a straight line. The guy with the arrow can make it, but the other guy is blocked by the wall.

Because of the shallow step, we said you don’t need pathfinder here.

Edit. Nor would we use the placement rules, since this stair is modeled into the terrain to allow model placement. Yes, it means larger based models can’t get past this fortification.

So the troll wouldn’t need pathfinder or placement rules to walk up, but would need pathfinder to charge up.

“Up” and “down” change the line of movement.

The model in question did move in a straight line, in what was a legal path (though may have ended in a failed charge).

And then before its movement ended, it was affected by something the caused it to be repositioned - not, ver batim, placed.

Whether the model could move in the path it took isn’t in question.

What’s up in the air is whether it could use the stairs/ladder at all and, if so, whether its charge movement would have to end after being “repositioned” and, if not, how the continued path is determined.

Rules as written, if you are placed by the stairs it is a place effect and would end the Charge movement. But, it f you end the places movement with your Charge target in range, then it is successful. So you can run into the elevator, push the button, travel up, and reach your target and get the Charge.

But, for non-placed stairs, talk it through with your opponent.

By this logic, one could not charge from flat ground to a hill of any kind.

I lack the time to draw diagrams and so forth, so in brief, I’m going to invoke this:

Excessive pedantry tells us that it’s impossible to move in a perfectly straight line on any physical table. We all know this and yet we manage to charge, slam, and trample all the time. :slight_smile:

I have never once encountered a single player who correctly measured the distance “up or down” a hill, up to and including any staff I have ever played a game with. No one does that. It’s always treated as a straight-line movement even if in actuality there’s a tiny bit of trivial vertical movement involved.

We also all know that we can absolutely charge over physical terrain such as mine fields, forests, rough terrain, etc., etc. that is represented by physical three-dimensional objects. No one fails a charge when they come to the edge of a piece of physical terrain. And for that matter, I have never once seen a player properly subtract the 1/16" from their movement for moving “up” a piece of mousepad terrain.

But besides all that, Hills tell us exactly how to interact with them while moving:
You move up and down it normally. (No, “normally” isn’t defined in the rules, because no one should have to define “normally.” C’mon now. :stuck_out_tongue:)

Common sense tells us that moving up or down stairs and ladders implies non-trivial vertical distance, so much so that the rules tell you you have to choose to “move up or down” them:

I’m not even going to attempt to prove that models can’t do nonsensical things like move directly up into the air when they advance, which is where examples in discussions like this usually end up. :rofl:

Conceptually and thematically, charging up a ladder doesn’t fit. (“I’m angrily charging you! Now I’m angrily climbing this 30 foot ladder at you! Hang on! …Okay now I’m angrily charging you again!”)

You get to the ladder by moving in a straight line. You move up or down the ladder. That is absolutely a non-trivial different straight line.* Models can only charge in a single straight line. citation needed**

Seeing as how we’re already at an impasse, let’s get official word on this.

Pretty please @elswickchuck , can you tell us all official-like if models can charge up ladders, stairs, or elevators? And what is the maximum duration elevator ride that is allowed? How long does a charging model have to ride in an elevator before it gets bored listening to the muzak and waiting for the elevator doors to open and forgets what it was doing there anyway? :stuck_out_tongue:

* If the vertical distance wasn’t somehow significant, one wonders why Flight is called out as having specific interactions with obstructions and other such elevated terrain, and why Flight is written so that it essentially acts as “I absolutely do not care about vertical distance.”

** I am absolutely not going to discuss whether or not models can charge in multiple discreet straight lines, because it’s silly. :stuck_out_tongue:

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I apologize but I might need someone to establish the original question. I think between it being asked and now the main premise has been lost.


Simply put: Can a model declare a charge against a target, move such that its charge path gets it to within 1” of a stair/ladder feature, use 2” of its movement to “climb” the stair/ladder, and be repositioned within 1” of the top of the stair/ladder?

If so, does the charging model’s movement automatically end, as it would if the model were pushed, slammed, or placed?

In the expertly crafted illustration below, the charging model (green) charges its target model (red) and after ascending the ladder is repositioned at the top (blue).

The heart of the question is:

Can you charge up or down a ladder?

That’s it, really. :slight_smile:

Thank you for the replies. I’ll post after discussion, but i believe the answer is no


Currently the answer is no you can not charge up or down a ladder


Thanks for the answer. For further clarification, can we know why? Place effects don’t cause a Charge to fail, they simply end the Charge movement. So if you end with your target in Range, it’s a successful Charge, right?

This is for ladders, and for non-modeled stairs that can’t have models on them, right? Not plateaus and modeled stairs that are an inch or less in height?

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Because, and i dont like using this word for this, technically the model is not moving alont the same straight line. Again it more so comes down to the functional aspect but in the end they just cant

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If referring to your secind oic you osted you can as long as the line does not contact something that would stop the charge movement.

If referring to your hill pic i would, and our store would, play that where you could charge up or down. I can see the argument based on not being able to but that more so looks like a hill that could be played either way and needs to be discussed before hand.


So, it is because the model is unable to draw a straight line that it could traverse, and therefore cannot declare a Charge against a Target on a higher elevation (one that requires the use of stairs, elevators, etc?)