Asking because the ruling on a similar question in regards to Dual Attack was a little ambiguous.
A unit with spellcasting charges
Two troopers are placed in engagement of an enemy model.
First trooper kills the model with its melee attack, leaving the second trooper no longer engaged.
Can that second trooper now cast a spell *Action?
And for context on the ambiguity, this is the post that was infernal’d as being correct. Im not sure if this would only apply to Dual Attack for reasons, or if you can translate the same to any other actions
“The check for melee range is done at the end of movement. If you kill the targets before they attack, they can still do their ranged attack.”
Apologies for not getting to this sooner; I’ve been busy.
I’m pretty confident that my answer in that thread is correct:
The rationale is explained in that thread, but, essentially: the “Did you make a successful charge?” check occurs at the end of movement. While the rule could be spelled out much more laboriously to avoid all confusion, the intent – confirmed by a rules Infernal in that thread – is as above.
While the thread and original question centered around Dual Attack, the rules discussion and rationale remains the same when considering other scenarios. “The check for melee range is done at the end of movement.”
The only restrictions explained in the rules are as follows:
This is checked at the end of movement. Do you have an enemy model in your melee range? If no, you forfeit your Combat Action. If yes, you obviously must still have a Combat Action, because you’re instructed to make a melee attack.
If, when it comes time to make your Combat Action and you still have an enemy model in your melee range, then you’re required to make a melee attack.
The rules don’t provide instruction in the other case: if you had an enemy model in your melee range at the end of charge movement, but now you don’t. The model still must obviously have a Combat Action because nothing says otherwise.
At this point, the only sensible choice remaining is that the model can do whatever it wants with its Combat Action, like normal.
(Other interpretations really fall apart, by the way. The “you must make a melee attack, no exceptions” argument naturally leads to this conclusion:
Your restriction on combat action is not lifted just because the enemy models are no longer there.
You havent given any rules based rationale for this being lifted. The rules clearly state that if the trooper ends movement in melee that it now has two options availavle for combat action:
make initial melee attacks
make a special attack with a melee weapon
That is your new truncated menu of options. The death of the enemy does not change this menu.
So the question we are left with is what happens when you choose initial melee attacks and have no legal targets to make attacks against.
I would argue the only sensible course of action is that you do not get to make the attacks.
Agreed. This is also how it has always worked and been interpreted and I see no change in verbiage from past editions. The other thread is about Dual
Attack and that can’t be dismissed.
Agreed, Dual Attack makes all the difference in the previous thread.
Dual attack specifially allows you to make initial ranged attacks when you choose to make your initial melee attacks. Which is something you can do when you successfully charge. So right in line with my rationale above.
In brief: I cited rules and provided an explanation for why I think I’m correct. Cite specific rules text and provide rationale if you believe it can be interpreted differently.
Provide some supporting evidence to back up your interpretation.
I think you will find that if you read the rules text and follow your own rationale, then Dual Attack breaks. Why? Because you have no enemy models in your melee range and you must forfeit your Combat Action.
You can’t have it both ways. Either the whole Combat Action goes, or you get to make the ranged attacks due to Dual Attack, which means you still have a Combat Action, which means…
A lot of my confusion right now currently stems from the Infernal specifically calling out the comment that only relates to End of Movement checks as being correct, instead of any statements or directives towards Dual Attack itself being the key component to making everything work.
“Troopers in the unit with enemy models in their melee range must use their Combat Actions to make either initial melee attacks or a special attack with a melee weapon. Troopers in the unit without an enemy model in their melee range must forfeit their Combat Actions this activation.
…
The rationale is explained in that thread, but, essentially: the “Did you make a successful charge?” check occurs at the end of movement.”
The top paragraph lays out the options for what a trooper may do during an activation in which a unit charges. The second (quoted from a post you may recognize ) clarifies the most important element here.
The check happens once, and it happens at the end of movement. It lays out 2 scenarios for troopers: no combat action, a combat action with restrictions on it.
Your line of reasoning disregards the restriction on combat action without justification.
It may help you to understand this by realizing that unit charges rules are intentionally analagous to independent model charges.
Here we see a similarly worded restriction for independant model charges. Here it is tied to having made a successful charge which is something the trooper being placed cannot do (since another trooper did the moving). This wording is a bit clearer but the unit charge rules work the same way.
When the unit declares the charge every trooper in that unit is bound to certain restrictions. The specific restriction is set when the unit ends its movement. The restriction remains in place throughout the combat action.
) clarifies the most important element here.