Khador's army starter options against Cygnar

I have been testing the Khador army starter against the Cygnar starter army. Here are some thoughts (and a bit of whining) about our options.

For the Motherland!


Should probably clarify that polarity shield only works for construct models. Khador seems to mostly shoot but you can charge them with your humies.

Yes, thanks. I discovered post publishing. I’ll fix it.

The Ionization rule on the Cygnar Standard only applies to electrical damage rolls. In your math it seems you think it applies to all damage rolls, including melee attacks, which it doesn’t.

Comparing the two main army boxes in a vacuum seems counterproductive. While true Cygnars box include stronger units in comparison, overall and with the expansion box and 80mm solo available Khador has alot of good tools and quite good game into Storm Legion imo.

Starting boxes aside I too find the winter guard massively lackluster for the price. It makes me pretty sad since I really like them thematically. I bought two starter boxes of them as well and once I can buy the expansion pack I seriously doubt I will play them much if at all.

To me the main problem is their shooting range is to low for how low their RAT is. They are extremely squishy and they are, in my opinion, significantly over costed as currently printed. I am very surprised if this is the level they wanted them to be at from play testing as I just do not see any real role for them other than just to be there to die. Almost every other 8 cost warrior unit can clear a unit of these in 1 turn. I’d rather honestly have 2 units of Arkanists than 1 unit of these guys every time.

I keep holding onto hope that they are going to surprise us with some model/caster later that buffs this unit in a way that makes the current point cost make sense.

Honestly even if this unit cost 6 points with the flag, as is, I still do not know that this would make me want play them.

To be fair I am a newer player as well so it could be just my lack of experience. But if that is the case then maybe I bought the wrong army to start with which makes me sad for such a newly released version of the game.

Unless rant

don’t understand so much about this unit.

Encumbered is a rule that should not be on them.

I don’t understand why rockets are range 8.

At best they are 1 point per model and should be a 5 points. In faction alone they are worth only 5.

They want to be 7 points they need way more rules. I don’t even know what you would give them to make them worth 7 points.

I know my autogunns still kill stuff. I just don’t feel like its worth 7 points for two autoguns at speed 5.

End Unless rant.

The Khador army start is a sad affair compared to the other MK4 starter boxes, and what looks to be coming this year.

The WKI have a high cost of this weird utility that is really low tier. Even the shock troopers will be bumped out of anyone’s list once the expansion arrives.

The only value in the box is the warjacks and arkansit.

I feel like I am legitimately missing something in those last few replies! :slightly_smiling_face:

How many of you folks have actually put the models on the table and fought it out? I’m getting a strong “classic theorymachine” vibe here!

Random thought or two and then I have to run!

  • I feel like the Guard Tower is tailor-made for Winter Korps! Six RAT 8 SP 14 scattergun shots with an effective ~18” range? Yes please! Laughing at blast damage and attempts to melee them? Yes! Forcing the opponent to commit multiple heavies just to deal with ~8 points of the army? Yes please!

  • I think the Winter Korps expansion box has some real gold in it, helping answer a lot of the “Cygnar MoW” questions! I was really skeptical of Pikemen at first, but I’ve really warmed to them! Effectively blast-immune, small-arms-immune P+S 15-17 models? Oh yeah! And supported by the Bison and Suppressors? Love it!

Plus, Valerii is the obvious damage-dealer in Winter Korps. :slightly_smiling_face:

Maybe somebody with more table experience than me can provide actual insights informed by actual play, but I am pretty optimistic with what I’ve seen so far! :slightly_smiling_face:


There is light on the horizon. However, my idea with this “review” (and hopefully more to follow) is based on what is in the army starters only.

I think there is a point in looking at the starter armies in a vacuum. Presumedly this is where new players would start, each with their own starter army. I personally think that the first games played before any (more) major investments are made should be as equal as possible. Thereby teaching skills rather than relying on any difference in models strengths.

So, Guard Towers, Bunker, expansion sets, additional 'caster (I’m so much looking forward to Valerii) and mercenaries are ignored. As an example, the Snipers are going to make our life so much more fun, and we get a mechanic :slight_smile:

It is also clear that my Winter Korps have been performing better on the table than on paper. If this is down to my incredible abilities, lucky dice rolls or unlucky opponents is better left unsaid.

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Thanks, I’ll fix that.

I think we are talking different things here. The main issue is the Winter Korps Infantry and Standard. This happens to make up the mass majority of the models you get in the starter army box.

The shock trooper gunners and Arkanists I like a lot. However they are not as good into the other models in the Cygnar and orgoth starters. This is an on the table playing games feel. I agree that they should have shifted what they put into the boxes for Khador a bit more.

That being said the Winter Korps Infantry feels so bad when you play them once I have anything else to use I highly doubt they will see the table unless I am running a demo against a non Khador player as they currently stand.

My experience with the infantry have been with average to low dice rolls and its been frustrating.

Plus as soon as my Brineblood Marauders come out I’m jumping ship. I’m a pirate at heart.

I guess a lot of these negative impressions (including my own) are because at a glance, Mk4 Khador looks like Mk3 Khador, only worse. Winter Korps infantry looks like WG Infantry/Riflemen, with worse attachments (and no Jozef to buff them). Ekaterina looks like a cheap version of Zerkova, and the WK Snipers like poor man’s Widowmakers. It’s not that any of them are necessarily bad, just that we “used to have better things”. Even though they’re not directly comparable.

Also the fact that the WK starter is very shooting-oriented, but lacking the ranged buffs (or even basic stats) that Cygnar used to have.

It’s unfortunate because I really love the new Khador aesthetics, and I’ll always be a proud son of the Motherland at heart (starting with Khador back in Mk1), but the Winter Korps doesn’t looks like an army I’d have fun playing.

I think they are referring specifically to the Winter Korps Infantry unit, rather than the box as a whole. Storm Trooper Gunners are great, no question there. The Winter Korps Infantry just don’t quite hit the mark. They should either be cheaper, or need some kind of improvement.

Winter Korps Infantry guns are lackluster compared to other options, especially once the Suppressors release, and some of their rules don’t do much. As an example, the standard bearer gives them rise, but they don’t have access to tough outside of a single unit using a single command card, and most other things that would knock them down pretty easily kill an armor 13 model. This can be partially offset by things like girded or Iron Flesh, but the unit is rarely useful enough that you want to dedicate resources to helping them stay alive.

Love seeing articles and blogs getting out there! A few clarifications from the Cygnar side:

You said the banner buffs the infantry melee damage rolls, but it only buffs the typed electricity rolls. It’s possible there could be typed electricity in the future, but for now its just on guns, spells and eleaps.

Polarity shield doesn’t prevent infantry charges, just constructs. The banner also lacks polarity shield so if stormblades bring the banner you can charge it with your constructs.

You also mentioned that Stormguard are arm 17 when charged, they are still only arm 15. Set defense applies to just the attack roll ( consider them def 15 vs charges). Same thing for the courser, doesn’t buff the armor.

One thing to note is that Storm legion can bring deflection to buff the whole army’s defense by 2 vs shooting, and that Athena’s defense formation will apply to all of her jacks so their statlines often are 2 armor better than they are on paper.

What my Meta has been seeing:

The advantages that you get from the Khador side is your jacks are far superior. Great bears are to strykers what legionaires are to winter korps infantry. You also can take 8 heavies to storm legion’s 4.

We have seen the WKI be quite weak, they should be promptly replaced by sharpshooters for anti infantry duty or suppressors with Sav for anti-everything duty.

Boris is a good caster, but i think Kat or Sav are better anti-storm legion casters so its a bit unfortunate right out of the box.

So basically a lot of khador vs cygnar evens out when you get more stuff, but you’re correct that in a 1 box vs 1 box scenario storm legion would be favoured.


I think I agree the WK starter set is a bit weak.

  1. the arcanists are the worst support unit from the new factions seen so far.
  2. the shock gunners are not flexible, and have very poor defensive stats to go along with their useful resistances.
  3. the WKI have good output. I personally see no point in the RPG, but the LMG and the grenades are good. They are costed like a 5 point unit with 1 point WA you have to take. I think this pricing is slightly too expensive. But 2 LMG is with 8 points I think.

Borisyuk doesn’t have any synergy with gunners or WKI really. I’ve found WKI are good with him still.

Jacks = great.
solo = ok
Gunners = not useful except their narrow specialist field.
WKI = bit expensive and some choices are bad.
Boris = fun with a gun.

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Wow, that’s the first time I’ve heard that take! :astonished:

For the first time ever, Khador can have fully-fueled warjacks and have their caster actively do something meaningful during the turn. Outside of highly specific situations over the years, that’s been completely unheard of in the faction before!

The Arkanists are the very first unit on my “buy more as soon as they’re available for individual purchase” list!


Compare them to the other factions empower units, and I think they are the worst.

3 empowers is really good, for cheap, but their other abilities are less useful than the balance of other stuff.

The Cygnar guys for example triggger the accumulator for their heavies and are arm17 5 boxes.

But Khador is arguably more focus-starved than e.g. Cygnar, so Khador gets more value out of Empower. Doesn’t really matter what else they do.

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the empower units have awesome sprays, AAT 5 is a bit low, but sprays ignore cover, concealment and stealth so on the balance of it they end up being reasonably accurate, and both Kat and Sav can buff that accuracy (and sav buffs the damage!)

I don’t think comparing the fact the cygnar guys trigger accumulator is a good comparison because the accumulator is triggered by literally every warrior in storm legion - so its more of a stryker feature than the mechanic unit feature.

I think i would rate them as better than the Dusk ones. i know Spell ward is strong in some matches, but its also dead in other matches, and Nukhador has access to its own anti magic tech anyway.

But all empower units are fantastic. I think even the worst empower unit is a great tool in its faction and not something to be sad about.